[Deejay]

Kineas, on 17 October 2009 - 04:14 PM, said:

When did you add me? I have a guy called Deejay209 on my psn and I assumed it was you?

Nup, I ended up going with 'KingDeej' because 'DeeJay' was obviously taken. You're just 'Kineas' right?

[Kineas]

Deejay, on 17 October 2009 - 04:16 PM, said:

Nup, I ended up going with 'KingDeej' because 'DeeJay' was obviously taken. You're just 'Kineas' right?

Kin-eas (Kineas was taken )

[Deejay]

Kineas, on 17 October 2009 - 04:18 PM, said:

Kin-eas (Kineas was taken )

Awesome...guess I just made friends with a stranger then...

[mrlefty]

Well... it's pretty. Not a huge fan of the gameplay itself though; Drake controls fairly roughly, and the distinction between things he can grab onto when climbing and things he can't is kind of immersion-breaking.

Still, it does look very, very good.

I'm just not sold that it's deserving of the ludicrously high score it's got on metacritic.

PS With the multiplayer, is there any way of picking a local match? It seems to take forever to find opponents and then it's painfully laggy.

[Matt]

You're like Yahtzee, but without being funny or informed. You only ever see the bad in great games. Enjoy drinking from your half empty glass. I'll be over here enjoying the everloving hell out of a fantastic game.

[mrlefty]

Matt, on 18 October 2009 - 03:52 PM, said:

You're like Yahtzee, but without being funny or informed. You only ever see the bad in great games. Enjoy drinking from your half empty glass. I'll be over here enjoying the everloving hell out of a fantastic game.

Jesus Christ.

(a) I wasn't trying to be funny.
(b ) "Informed"? In what way was my experience with the game ill-informed?
(c ) I don't "only" ever see the bad in games. There are plenty of games I love and praise. I bought this game on the day it was released, hoping it would live up to the commendations it's received.

Why, in a thread discussing a game, would honest opinion be attacked in such a personal way? By the host of the site, no less?

Back to the game, I'm up to the bit where

Spoiler

he's jumping about in an ice cave (leaping across chasms and grabbing icy ledges) and throwing his life about because some German guy told him to go check out his failed expedition. Drake's gone from being heroic to being a little bit nuts.

That train sequence was pretty awesome, though, I have to say.

[syke]

Deejay, on 17 October 2009 - 09:15 AM, said:

Jumped online yesterday. Looked really fun and was performing well right up until my input kept freezing every 5-15 seconds. I'd be running along, shooting or taking cover or whatever, and then right at the critical moment, my character just stops running, lowers his gun and just stands there for a bit. Everyone else keeps moving around and killing me just fine, so it's not a connection issue, and my controller is plugged in so it's nothing to do with that.

Got frustrated and quit after about 5 minutes.

Yeah I got this whenever someone would use the internet in the house... that may be your problem.

And the eyes were intense. A bit freaky, lol

Mr Lefty, I think you're being attacked because your' post is negative. Even when you say how pretty the game is, you make out like it's a game all about the looks and everything else is subpar. You make two complaints, one of which is the case of most online games for us Aussies. Really, the game is AMAZING, yet you nitpick remote details and fail to mention anything good about the game.

You are looking at the glass half empty.

[Matt]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 04:39 PM, said:

Jesus Christ.

(a) I wasn't trying to be funny.

I didn't say you were. I meant to imply that Yahtzee's ranting and almost unrelieved negativity is justified by his genuinely effective humour. Yours isn't. It's just a grumpy old man.

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 04:39 PM, said:

(b ) "Informed"? In what way was my experience with the game ill-informed?

I didn't criticise your experience, I criticized your opinion. And again by comparison to Yahtzee that his knowledge of the topic is exceptional, as one of the world's foremost critics, and one who has also worked in development. You run a blog. Not that there's anything wrong with that. I'm similarly I'll informed by that comparison.

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 04:39 PM, said:

(c ) I don't "only" ever see the bad in games. There are plenty of games I love and praise. I bought this game on the day it was released, hoping it would live up to the commendations it's received.

Seems I only really see your negatives then. Maybe I should look more into your positive blog... What's it called again? Oh yeah. When Games Suck.

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 04:39 PM, said:

Why, in a thread discussing a game, would honest opinion be attacked in such a personal way? By the host of the site, no less?

That you are entitled to an opinion doesn't make that opinion immune from criticism or challenge. And me being a host of the website doesn't preclude me from having an opinion of my own.

If you want to argue your case go for it, but don't act all butthurt because someone disagreed with you..

[mrlefty]

Like in the podcast, you attacked ME, not the specifics of the opinion I'd expressed.

An opinion which, I might add, wasn't even wholly negative itself! You'll note that even in my criticism of Uncharted 2 I praised the game's graphics.

PS You appear to be reading "When Games Suck" as if it was called "Games Suck". The word "when" is kind of critical.

[Kineas]

Quote

When Games Suck - taking the niggling, irritating game design flaws that waste gamers' time and piss us off - and rubbing them in the designers' faces.

While we're on this topic, that is a very cunt thing to say, let alone have as a tagline for your website. They made something that you didn't enjoy, not urinate on your shit.

[Comrade Questions]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 06:16 PM, said:

Like in the podcast, you attacked ME, not the specifics of the opinion I'd expressed.

An opinion which, I might add, wasn't even wholly negative itself! You'll note that even in my criticism of Uncharted 2 I praised the game's graphics.

PS You appear to be reading "When Games Suck" as if it was called "Games Suck". The word "when" is kind of critical.

Pretty sure the only game you praised over there was...

Mirror's Edge.

Lol

And you praised it with italics around looks. Implying that the only thing it has going for it is that it has nice graphics. Ignoring the awesome story, great voice acting, great music and mostly awesome gameplay.

But anyway, i don't know why I bother, because you're just a fucking troll.

e- you even complain about Matt using his website to complain about you... on your website.

[mrlefty]

Claude the Duck King, on 18 October 2009 - 09:41 PM, said:

Pretty sure the only game you praised over there was...

Mirror's Edge.

Lol

Nup. Try again. I did think ME had promise, until I played the full game and its myriad flaws became obvious. I've regularly praised the Valve games. I praised Shadow Complex and Splosion Man. Arkham Asylum. Battlefield Bad Company. Call of Duty 4. Undoubtedly many others.

Quote

And you praised it with italics around looks. Implying that the only thing it has going for it is that it has nice graphics. Ignoring the awesome story, great voice acting, great music and mostly awesome gameplay.

The graphics - including some stellar art design - are indeed the game's biggest selling point. The music's good. The voice acting's good. The story's okay - a fairly predictable Indiana Jones ripoff so far, but it's not painful. (At least it's a ripoff of the decent Indiana Jones movies.) The gameplay is mostly clumsy platforming. I note that neither you nor Matt has responded to my specific criticisms regarding the weird way it decides what handholds it'll let you grab and which it won't, or the laggy online.

Quote

But anyway, i don't know why I bother, because you're just a fucking troll.

You have got to be kidding. YOU are calling someone else a troll? The vast majority of your comments on this site are nothing more than trying to goad people. (Which, admittedly, I fall for every time.)

Quote

e- you even complain about Matt using his website to complain about you... on your website.

I don't care if Matt "complains" about me; I just thought the personal abuse was way over the top. You'll notice I didn't respond with personal abuse.

Kineas - it's a perfectly reasonable thing to say. These games aren't cheap.

[Korthal]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 09:53 PM, said:

Kineas - it's a perfectly reasonable thing to say. These games aren't cheap.

Of which it is your own personal opinion and not necessarily that of the majority of the players. Alot of the shit you've stated you hate, I infact love. And vice versa. Doesn't make you wrong, doesn't make me wrong either.

[mrlefty]

Korthal, on 18 October 2009 - 10:04 PM, said:

Of which it is your own personal opinion and not necessarily that of the majority of the players. Alot of the shit you've stated you hate, I infact love. And vice versa. Doesn't make you wrong, doesn't make me wrong either.

Obviously it's my own personal opinion.

Just out of interest, which things that I've condemned do you love?

[Korthal]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 10:08 PM, said:

Obviously it's my own personal opinion.

Just out of interest, which things that I've condemned do you love?

Quite a few. I very much disliked BF:BC as well as CoD4, don't like them at all. The standard tedious gameplay from them I just don't find interesting in the slightest, and yet many others do. Which is more than fine.

SW:TFU you had a massive problem with, I personally actually quite enjoyed it for what it was and didn't find the little 'niggling' things an issue in the slightest. L4D being another, those particular issues don't seem to apply to everyone, certainly not myself or others with whom I play. Apparently the RB/GH Series are also both tedious and not fun. I disagree. I could keep going if need be, but really everything i'm seeing is merely personal opinion and far from specific game flaws that are designed to piss us off...

[mrlefty]

Korthal, on 18 October 2009 - 10:21 PM, said:

Quite a few. I very much disliked BF:BC as well as CoD4, don't like them at all. The standard tedious gameplay from them I just don't find interesting in the slightest, and yet many others do. Which is more than fine.

SW:TFU you had a massive problem with, I personally actually quite enjoyed it for what it was and didn't find the little 'niggling' things an issue in the slightest. L4D being another, those particular issues don't seem to apply to everyone, certainly not myself or others with whom I play. Apparently the RB/GH Series are also both tedious and not fun. I disagree. I could keep going if need be, but really everything i'm seeing is merely personal opinion and far from specific game flaws that are designed to piss us off...

You're listing games discussed as if they were just broadly reviewed. WGS is not trying to be a review site; I'm simply seeking to explore particular gameplay ideas or game design approaches that I either want to see more or less of in videogames, and why.

PS I'm not sure when I've suggested RB/GH are "tedious" and "not fun". I criticised the system for sending faulty drum kits back, but I quite enjoy RB/GH. I love L4D. I just wish the matchmaking on the 360 was more friendly to Australians.

I had a problem with certain specific things in SWTFU - did you like the sparse checkpoint system combined with cheap deaths, forcing you to replay large sections? The nerfed force powers and lightsabers (who knew enemies in the Star Wars universe could be immune to both?) The GoW ripoff QTEs? The HIT THIS BUTTON REALLY FAST sections? The haphazard targeting? They were trying to do something similar in that game to what Uncharted 2 pulls off, but they didn't get close. And I'm not a huge fan of the gameplay in Uncharted 2.

[Comrade Questions]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 09:53 PM, said:

The gameplay is mostly clumsy platforming. I note that neither you nor Matt has responded to my specific criticisms regarding the weird way it decides what handholds it'll let you grab and which it won't, or the laggy online.

Never had a problem with any of the platforming at all, found the climbing mechanism to be probably the most intuitive method I've ever experienced and the online I've played (played in the beta for weeks, played the full game quite a bit) actually has good netcode, even when you don't get all local players.

Maybe, just maybe, it's not when games suck. Maybe it's when YOU suck. Maybe. The only issue I had with the gameplay was the cover mechanic.

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 09:53 PM, said:

You have got to be kidding. YOU are calling someone else a troll? The vast majority of your comments on this site are nothing more than trying to goad people. (Which, admittedly, I fall for every time.)

If anyone would be qualified to recognise I troll then...

[Korthal]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 10:32 PM, said:

I had a problem with certain specific things in SWTFU - did you like the sparse checkpoint system combined with cheap deaths, forcing you to replay large sections? The nerfed force powers and lightsabers (who knew enemies in the Star Wars universe could be immune to both?) The GoW ripoff QTEs? The HIT THIS BUTTON REALLY FAST sections? The haphazard targeting?

Didn't phase me all that much, no. I quite enjoyed it. Thought it was fun, had absolutely no issues with the check points, they (as far as im concerned) were spread out fine enough for me. Per the powers & lightsabers, i really could care less tbh... I'm playing a game, not trying to decide whether or not it deserves an oscar for its performance. QTE's i could also care less about whether or not they were similar to something else. Targetting was also a non-issue for me.

See? Opinion. You hated it, I did not. Much like Joaby despises the Halo series for his reasons, and i love it for my own. Does this suddenly make us all incorrect because we are refusing to acknowledge someone elses opinion on a game and supposedly ignoring the 'flaws' and 'faults' associated? No... It's really REALLY not that big of a deal, and yet every time it seems to be blown out of epic proportions.

[mrlefty]

Korthal, on 18 October 2009 - 10:42 PM, said:

See? Opinion. You hated it, I did not. Much like Joaby despises the Halo series for his reasons, and i love it for my own. Does this suddenly make us all incorrect because we are refusing to acknowledge someone elses opinion on a game and supposedly ignoring the 'flaws' and 'faults' associated? No... It's really REALLY not that big of a deal, and yet every time it seems to be blown out of epic proportions.

That's like something Joaby said, too. You get that my expressing a personal opinion isn't a denial of your personal opinions, right?

[Korthal]

mrlefty, on 18 October 2009 - 10:44 PM, said:

That's like something Joaby said, too. You get that my expressing a personal opinion isn't a denial of your personal opinions, right?

Yes, and the condescending nature of which you post is what pisses people off. All threads become a shitfest full of nothing but attacks back and forth, and frankly there's very little argumentative intelligence behind what is merely children throwing a tantrum at one another.